Roundtable - Week 17

  Posted 12/24 by Staff, Exclusive to Footballguys.com

Welcome to the Week 17 edition of the 2008 Footballguys Roundtable. Feel free to eavesdrop as various staff members share their views on a range of topics in discussion format. This week, they touch on the following:

• Week 17 Games
• First Rounders in 2009
• Playoff Predictions
• Offseason Coaching Changes
• College Bowl Games
  

Week 17 Games

We're down to the last week of the regular season, where many teams' playoff hopes will be dashed or fulfilled.

The Dolphins control their own destiny in the AFC East. If Pennington can beat his old team in the Meadowlands, the Dolphins will take down the division regardless of what the Patriots do on Sunday. If the Jets win, they'll need the Patriots to lose to win the AFC East, or they'll need the Ravens to lose to get a wildcard spot.

CHASE STUART: This is a brutal week for Jets fans. Many will be rooting for Miami to win this week to avoid having the hated Patriots win the division. The obvious storyline of Chad Pennington returning to the Meadowlands is interesting. He's played extremely well all season long -- does he have one more great game in him? He's not a terrific cold-weather QB, and if any team knows how to stop him, it's the Jets. Week one was a long time ago, but I'm sure he's hoping to improve on that performance.

Pennington has only 8 combined fumbles and interceptions. The record for combined fumbles and INTs in a 16-start season is 10, shared by Steve DeBerg (1990), Troy Aikman (1995), Jeff Garcia (2002) and Jake Plummer (2005). Pennington hasn't even lost either of his fumbles; he's done an outstanding job at protecting the ball...

Some of the early games will have an effect on the implications of the late games.

JEFF PASQUINO: I don't quite get why the NFL has some games early and others late.

The Eagles may give up if Tampa Bay wins, for example. Why not have Oakland and Tampa Bay at 4PM?

I get that you need to have some games at each time slot, but in Week 17 you shouldn't be letting an early same-day kickoff influence a late game.

I still remember the Eagles winning a division because the Cowboys were upset at 1PM and they pulled everyone in the late game.

I count at least four games with no playoff implications: Kansas City-Cincinnati, Detroit-Green Bay, Cleveland-Pittsburgh, and Washington-San Francisco.

Baltimore is at 4PM, but they could pull starters if New England loses, and the MIA/NYJ outcome will impact New England as well. All three of those games should be at the same time.

Jason, what do you think of Jeff's point about the early games affecting the late games? You're an Eagles fan, and the Eagles need some help Sunday morning to make their afternoon game meaningful.

JASON WOOD: Not surprisingly I'll be fixated on the Tampa/Oakland game because I desperately need the Raiders to pull off an unexpected win to keep the Eagles chances alive. If, and only if, the Bucs lose their 4th straight will the Eagles have a shot at the playoffs by beating the hated Cowboys at home in Week 17. You can't ask for more than that as a fan; but it will be REALLY anticlimactic to endure a cold weather home game where you know the outcome doesn't matter.

Aside from the Eagles trying to get a wildcard spot, what down-to-the-wire division races do you find compelling?

JASON WOOD: I'm also particularly interested in the NFC North situation. Can Chicago come from way back and win the division with Captain Neckbeard at the helm? That would be hard to believe. And would failure to hold onto the division lead put pressure on Brad Childress' job?

In a similar vein, can Denver - who looked offensively potent early in the year - do enough to stem their own huge swan dive? The Chargers haven't played up to expectations all season, and even LT hasn't been "LT", but they could conceivably make the playoffs at 8-8.

This is a year when a lot of people are going to crow about the playoff seedings; although I suspect nothing will come of it. But realistically there's an excellent chance that two 8-8 teams will make the playoffs while as many as four teams with 10 or more wins might be shut out. This was a year of the haves and the have nots, for sure.

Will, what are the games you'll be most interested in?

WILL GRANT: Like Jason, I think it will be interesting to see if Chicago can somehow make it back to win the division and make the playoffs. Back in week 1, you'd have a very hard time finding ANYONE who would have thought that the Bears would even be 8-8 this season. Now they have a legitimate chance to win 10 games. That HAS to be considered a success from anyone's perspective, given the talent that they have had on the field this season. However, despite being out of the playoffs, Houston is going to fight to the end and it will be difficult for the Bears to win in Houston.

The Detroit-Green Bay game also holds a bit of interest, simply because Detroit will not want to be the first ever 0-16 team while the Packers will not be one to just roll over for a division opponent, especially at home in front of their fans. This game will be a snow fest given the weather that has hit the mid-west this week and it should be a fun game to watch. Cold but not too cold and lots of snow. These guys may be slugging it out right to the very end.

First Rounders in 2009

It's not too early to start thinking about the 2009 season.

In a hypothetical 1/2/3/1/1/1 league with standard FBG scoring (no PPR), list your top twelve players in the order you'd draft them if you took part in a draft today.

JEFF PASQUINO: With no PPR and with so few stud RBs, I still think you have to go RB in the first round. While there are a few choice WRs like Fitzgerald and Boldin that deserve mention, several good ones should make it to Round 2 and you can stock up there and Round 3 for your WR1 and WR2 options.

I'll narrow the field to guys that I believe can dominate touches in their respective backfields and can carry a team - fantasy or NFL: Tomlinson, Westbrook, Michael Turner, Marshawn Lynch, DeAngelo Williams, Matt Forte, Marion Barber, Kevin Smith, Joseph Addai, Maurice Jones-Drew, Clinton Portis, Larry Johnson, Adrian Peterson, Thomas Jones, Brandon Jacobs, Frank Gore, Steven Jackson, and Chris Johnson.

Now to cut it to 12. Lynch will lose touches to Fred Jackson. DeAngelo has been a stud all year (the quietest 20 TD season I can remember) but Jonathan Stewart will remain a threat for touches. Joe Addai gets hurt too much and he's been outplayed by Rhodes. Marion Barber's backfield is crowded with Choice and Felix Jones. Kevin Smith is in Detroit. Larry Johnson is showing signs of age. So eliminating those guys, here is my list of the top twelve, in order:

Ranking

1. Adrian Peterson - Too explosive to push down the list, even with Chester Taylor stealing touches.
2. Brian Westbrook - Injuries always a concern, but when he's healthy there's few better.
3. LaDainian Tomlinson - Assuming he is 100% again.
4. Michael Turner - He has earned this spot.
5. Maurice Jones-Drew - Assuming Fred Taylor is out of the picture.
6. Chris Johnson - If LenDale is out of the picture, he can be Top 5.
7. Matt Forte - Dominates touches on a team that needs him.
8. Steven Jackson - Injury risk, but very explosive.
9. Frank Gore - Needs to stay healthy, but job security here.
10. Clinton Portis - The wheels will fall off soon, but stud RB1 when 100%.
11. Brandon Jacobs - Dominant, but a free agent.
12. Thomas Jones - Needs the Jets to be a passing threat next year.

Addai and Barber are just outside the Top 12 but very close. Both can put up big numbers if their offenses are humming.

JASON WOOD: I differ with Jeff in a few spots. My Top 12 for next year would be...

1. Adrian Peterson - Best RB in the league.
2. Michael Turner - Proved he can handle a full workload.
3. Brian Westbrook - Just needs to stay healthy.
4. DeAngelo Williams - Big-play machine.
5. Maurice Jones-Drew - Will get more touches in 2009.
6. Matt Forte - He was not a fluke this year.
7. Clinton Portis - He's got at least one more strong season in him.
8. LaDainian Tomlinson - He's probably done as a top three fantasy RB, but he'll still be an every-week starter.
9. Frank Gore - Gore is tough to rank. He's got fantastic potential, but will likely remain inconsistent.
10. Chris Johnson - There's not a more explosive RB in the league.
11. Steve Slaton - Reminds me of MJD. Great combination of quickness and surprising power.
12. Marion Barber - He's a touchdown machine. A topnotch goal line runner.

WILL GRANT: And my 2009 first rounders:

1. Adrian Peterson - The upside is too great, and the division is going to be even worse next year.
2. Michael Turner - This team is only going to get better
3. Brian Westbrook - Heart and Soul of the Eagle Offense. In PPR league, it will be hard not to take him #1 overall.
4. Matt Forte - Key to the entire Chicago offense. Second year letdown? Hard to see how.
5. Marion Barber - Injuries slowed him this season, but I think he bounces back.
6. Maurice Jones-Drew - Taylor slowing down more and more.
7. Clinton Portis - Risk with Age but he's money in the bank
8. LaDainian Tomlinson - looking slow this year but still worth a look
9. Steven Jackson - Can't see passing on him this late, even with St. Louis in rebuilding mode.
10. Chris Johnson - Unless Tennessee turns into a throwing team overnight, Johnson will have a solid year.
11. Frank Gore - The one solid piece of this offense.
12. Brandon Jacobs - I'm starting to Believe.

Randy Moss and Tom Brady were often drafted in the first round this season. Would any of you consider drafting them in the top 12 next year, given that Brady is expected to return healthy? (He'll have a full 12 months between his injury and the week one game; with modern surgical techniques, that would seem to be plenty. Rivers tore his ACL just 7 months before this season and it didn't seem to affect him.)

JEFF PASQUINO: No. Brady is a crazy risk, and there always seems to be better QB value in the sixth round and beyond.

Moss is a 2nd round WR at best.

JASON WOOD: There's no way you can justify taking a QB coming off a torn ACL in the 1st round. It's the one position where you can routinely get top 5 production from targeting a player or two in the 5th-8th round, and even if Brady were to approximately his average production prior to his MVP season in 2007, he wouldn't be worth a 1st rounder.

WILL GRANT: I will never be a guy who says that you need to draft a QB in round 1. I was down on taking Brady in round 1 this year and I would be down on taking him or any other QB after this. The biggest problem with taking a QB in round 1 is that you basically lock yourself into drafting second tier RB and WR for the next 4 rounds. That's putting a lot of faith in a guy that could go down for the season after one quarter, or a lot of faith in your ability to mine RB and WR gold where others are not as good.

Moss is a high 3rd rounder at best next year. Sure he's still a 1000 yard, 10-TD receiver but the potential downside is pretty big and the potential upside is very limited. I'd rather be thinking of guys like Calvin, or Boldin or Marshall at the end of round 2 rather than Moss.

Jason has DeAngelo Williams in his top five, while Jeff and Will don't have him in their top twelve. Do you guys think he'll get too few touches to be a good first-round value?

JEFF PASQUINO: There's much downside risk with DeAngelo Williams for me in the first round. Jonathan Stewart isn't going anywhere, and Williams may not be able to make as many big plays on so few carries next season.

WILL GRANT: I did not rank DeAngelo Williams in the top 12 because I'm not convinced he's going to be the same player in 2009, and I think people are going to overpay for him next season. Stewart was drafted because the Panthers didn't expect Williams to be a star, and Williams was never able to push Foster out of the light. He's had a GREAT season this year, and I could be dead wrong on him... but the shift between 2007 (900 combined yards, 5 TDs) to 2008 (1500+, 20-TD+) is so vast that I'm wondering if we're not seeing a one-hit wonder. Expect him to demand a big fat raise after this season and we'll see if he can really live up to these numbers for 2009.

All of you have Chris Johnson in your first round next year, but only Jason has Steve Slaton up there even though both backs had extremely similar stats this year. What's keeping Slaton's value depressed?

JEFF PASQUINO: Slaton's a nice RB this year for sure (helped me in a few leagues to boot) but I expect the Texans to get him some help. He doesn't seem like a 250+ touch guy. I think Chris Johnson is better able to handle a larger workload. LenDale White has one year remaining on his contract, but I don't think he'll be as big a factor in 2008.

Tomlinson is an interesting one. Jeff P. has him at #3 and the others have him down around in the bottom half of round one.

MAURILE TREMBLAY: I think it's a tough call. One the one hand, I don't want to write the guy off after one injury-hampered season. He keeps himself in top physical shape throughout the offseason and the whole time he has been in the league he has worked to extend his career (using tips he learned from Emmitt Smith).

On the other hand, Darren Sproles is just the better player right now. Sproles is a free agent, so Sproles himself may not be a factor for the Chargers next year, but it's hard to ignore the fact that LT is obviously not the best RB in the league anymore if he's not even the best RB on his own team. Is it just because of injury, or have his skills started to decline?

I don't have the answer, but I have the feeling I'll be drafting him in 2009 based on upside potential whenever I have a pick in the #3-#6 range. I think his downside (if he stays healthy) will be about equal to his 2008 season while his upside would be to finish as a top two RB.

But I wouldn't feel comfortable drafting him that high because he just isn't nearly as explosive right now as he used to be.

JEFF PASQUINO: LT2 has been banged up and so has his offensive line. Tomlinson is lacking his cutting ability with the toe problem.

If his O-line and his toe both get better you may see him revisiting that elite production level once again.

There's a pretty wide range on Marion Barber as well.

How confident/worried are you that Felix Jones and Tashard Choice won't/will eat significantly into Barber's stats?

JEFF PASQUINO: I've been saying this for weeks, and I'll stick to it.

The 2009 Dallas Cowboys will run a backfield very similar to that of the 2008 Giants. Barber will have a role analogous to Brandon Jacobs but with more receptions. Choice will play Derrick Ward's part, while Felix Jones will be cast as Ahmad Bradshaw. That makes a great deal of sense to me as Jones is also a KR/PR like Bradshaw, and Choice's style is between Barber and Jones.

As for Barber's value - he has elite upside if either get hurt. He's also made the Pro Bowl as a nonstarter (Julius Jones - seriously?) and was very productive on 15-18 touches a game. There's no reason to not think that he can't do that again.

Playoff Predictions

Which team from each conference do you see making it through the playoffs to the Super Bowl? Who will take down the Lombardi trophy this year?

JEFF PASQUINO: Pittsburgh and Indianapolis are two good teams that may fight for the AFC early. They are the two playing the best right now. Roethlisberger had a terrible game in Tennessee, but overall the Steelers are playing very well. The Colts have won eight in a row and are the hottest #5 seed in long time.

The NFC is wide open, but I like Carolina's chances with that ground game. Losing to the Giants hurts, but as long as they get the #2 spot they should be poised for a run to the NFC Title game.

CHASE STUART: I see a lot to like out of Pittsburgh, Baltimore and Tennessee, but I also question the ability of those teams to win in the playoffs; you need to score some points in the playoffs and I'm not sure those teams can keep up. I'd still put Pittsburgh as my favorite in the AFC, but any of the six teams (assuming NE and SD join Indianapolis) have legitimate arguments to being the toughest out in the AFC. I expect all of the playoff games to be hotly contested.

The NFC is a different story. I'm only impressed with the Giants, Panthers and Falcons. I don't believe in Dallas, Chicago, Tampa, Minnesota, Arizona or Philadelphia. I'd be very surprised if the NFC Championship Game wasn't between two of New York-Carolina-Atlanta.

I predict the Steelers to win the Super Bowl, with a close win over the Giants. While the Panthers have been impressive this season, I think that team still lacks something. I can't put my finger on it, but either the run defense or the passing game is bound to flounder at some point in the postseason. The Giants are a flawed team and not as good as last year's version (Strahan, Umenyiora, Burress) but I think being at home is a huge advantage.

JASON WOOD: I have to agree with Chase about the NFC to an extent, in that Carolina and New York seem like the class acts to me. On the other hand, I'm not buying Atlanta. For as good as Matt Ryan has been, there's no way you can convince me a rookie QB is going to get to the promised land, just won't happen. While I certainly hope the Eagles squeak into the playoffs, it's a total crapshoot as to which version will show up. They've looked like monsters at times this year and like absolute pretenders other times. It's hard to believe a team that inconsistent, particularly when it comes to running the ball, could string together a month of playoff success. Arizona is a paper tiger. They can't win on the road and the offensive line is showing cracks. I have no faith in them. Minnesota strikes me as a team to watch. On the face of things, they're not very different from Carolina. Bernard Berrian has shown himself to be an explosive wideout, they have an excellent running back and a very good backup; and their QB play is the X factor. If Minnesota gets in, I wouldn't be surprised to see them make some noise. Dallas, while talented, seems dysfunctional at this point, and the defense hasn't played up to snuff.

In the AFC, it's hard to believe the Chargers are 7-8. Philip Rivers has had a monster season statistically and while LT hasn't been MVP-worthy, you have to think he is amped up to carry this team on his back and make up for what some felt was a letdown in last year's playoffs. The real question for them is whether DC Ron Rivera can continue to get improved play out of the defense. If he does, expect Rivera to land a head coaching job next year or at least get serious consideration. At the risk of sounding cliche, you have to think the Patriots are ripe for a big run. To lose Brady and then struggle to make the playoffs, I could see them being downright hungry if they make it. For once, they actually might have people rooting for them, too. For some reason I'm not buying Pittsburgh, don't know why. Indy and Tennessee are obviously tough to bet against, and I think either would make short work of Baltimore.

My prediction for the Super Bowl is that the Titans will beat the Giants in a low-scoring game. The Titans will face either the Patriots or Steelers in the AFC Championship game, while the Giants will face either the Vikings or the Panthers.

WILL GRANT: In the NFC, I think that the Giants' win over Carolina gives them the edge to make a return trip to the Super Bowl. I suspect that you're going to see Carolina facing them in the championship game though as the rest of the NFC looks pretty week. I give the Giants the edge because of the home field advantage.

In the AFC, I agree that Indy is the hot team and could be the bracket buster in the second round with a win over Tennessee. The Colts are hungry and they seem to be putting it together when it counts. They definitely have a shot to be in the championship game. On the other side, I think that Pittsburgh is playing tough but they have the 'something's missing' feel that could ultimately be their undoing. If Baltimore stays in and gets past Miami, it's going to be a slug fest in Pittsburgh for the title game. It will probably come down to Indy vs. Pittsburgh but I think Indy has the edge this year.

Indy against the Giants would be an interesting Super Bowl. The Giants one-two punch at RB can really expose a weakness in the Colts defense, and I think they'd have a solid chance to repeat as SB champs. However, the 'Peyton vs. Eli' thing would completely overshadow the game and eventually lead to many football fans throwing up. While I like the prospect of the NFL matchup, the thought of the media coverage gives me the shakes.

What are some of the less heralded teams that you think could do some real damage in the playoffs?

JEFF PASQUINO: Atlanta cannot be counted out. A rookie coach and a rookie quarterback are constantly mentioned, but the team runs the ball well and plays solid defense right now. They have as good a shot as any NFC team.

Baltimore is a nice dark horse. Another rookie coach and QB, but they have a great defense and a solid rushing game. As long as they keep the score low they will always be in the game. A trip to the AFC East champ doesn't sound too tough and then it is off to either Tennessee or Pittsburgh - teams that they have played down to the wire. It would not surprise me if they get to Tampa.

CHASE STUART: The Patriots and Chargers, if they make it in, will do some damage. They were in last year's AFC Championship game and while they're no longer as good, the rest of the AFC is down this season.

I'm on board with the Falcons being a legitimate sleeper in the NFC. Norwood and Turner might hit 2,000 combined rushing yards for the season and Matt Ryan is playing like a top five QB. The only problem is a run defense that will get shredded by either Carolina or New York; if Atlanta wins the #2 seed they might be able to advance to the Super Bowl, but asking them to win three playoff games is too much.

WILL GRANT: Baltimore is a team that I wouldn't want to play right now. They feel like last year's Jacksonville - A team that is going to play you hard for 60 minutes. They have had some tough last minute wins and losses late in the season, and they have proven that they can hand with the best in either conference. A Baltimore -Pittsburgh matchup in round 2 of the AFC playoffs would be an excellent game to watch.

In the NFC, I agree with Jeff and Chase that Atlanta might make the playoffs interesting. I can see them beating Arizona in round 1, but beating the Giants at home is going to be difficult. They have spark and are a tough team, but I think next year is a better chance for them.

Which highly rated teams do you think may make a surprise early exit?

JEFF PASQUINO: I think Tennessee may get bounced early. I don't know that they are playing all that well right now, despite their win over Pittsburgh. They don't usually win going away so if they get unlucky I don't know if they can come back on the scoreboard quickly.

The Giants are not playing well at all. They're backing in (if you can even do that) as the #1 seed with issues in their passing attack without Burress. Hixon doesn't command the same kind of respect in coverage which makes all the WRs that much worse when they face a strong secondary. Burress would take up a corner and a safety, but now Hixon gets single coverage and the extra defender stuffs an old Amani Toomer or a weaker option like Steve Smith. If Brandon Jacobs doesn't have a big game, they get bounced.

Arizona isn't highly regarded, but I don't see them going out into the elements and winning. One and done for them.

WILL GRANT: For all their hype, Minnesota is a pretender team. Tampa is finally healthy and I think they will give the Vikings a fit in the first round. I agree with Jeff that Arizona is also a one and done team in the NFC.

In the AFC, I am still not buying Tennessee as the best team in the NFL. I think Indy has a legitimate shot to bounce them in the second round. Denver is a disappointment of a team this season and they should count themselves lucky to be in it at all. Miami drew a rough start getting Baltimore in round 1.

As the other guys have pointed out, New England and San Diego are getting hot at the right time this year. If they somehow make the playoffs this week, expect them to play tough no matter who they are playing.

In the NFC, 9 or 10 wins in the NFC east is like 12 wins in another division. If Philly or Dallas make the playoffs, they both have the potential to beat anyone else in that bracket. Of the two, I think that the Eagles want it more and if they can make it to the postseason, they are going to have a shot at making the finals.

Offseason Coaching Changes

It seems like there are an unusually high number of coaches on the hot seat heading into the offseason this year.

Let's start in Buffalo. Will Dick Jauron be back next year?

JEFF PASQUINO: Dick Jauron should go. The QB situation is a mess and that offense has done nothing of late. The team looks like it has quit (despite the win over Denver). Fred Jackson finally got some playing time, something that should have happened a while ago.

JASON WOOD: Rumors are swirling that Jauron is a goner. I'm not sure how I feel about him as I don't sense he did a very bad job this year; the Bills weren't as talented as they played early in the season by any stretch. On the other hand, I've never viewed him as a great coach so a change would be justifiable.

WILL GRANT: The fact that Jauron has survived this long is a surprise to any Chicago fan that watched what he did to the Bears several years ago. Yet somehow I suspect that he'll start the 2009 season. This isn't a BAD team, only in a tough division. I think a new QB gives them a new face and makes them a better team.

Is there any chance that Romeo Crennel will be back in Cleveland?

JEFF PASQUINO: Can you get a touchdown on offense at some point? Romeo, Romeo.... good luck as a coordinator next year somewhere.

JASON WOOD: Romeo is a goner, it's just a matter of whether his GM follows him out the door.

WILL GRANT: Another year, another disappointment for Cleveland. They looked pretty good at the end of last season, but it turns out that Derek Anderson wasn't the QB of the future. A solid RB and a new coach could do wonders for this squad as they have some talent at WR and TE.

What about Marvin Lewis in Cincinnati?

JEFF PASQUINO: Marvin Lewis has lost this team on several occasions and they aren't going anywhere any time soon. Bringing back Chris Henry was not a good locker room move. The team is lost and needs new direction. That won't come from Lewis.

JASON WOOD: It's time we all admitted the Marvin Lewis era was a failure. Whether the cheap skate ownership will let him go is another question, but if this team wants to rebuild itself anew, it needs to jettison Lewis OR completely gut the team's personnel. It's much easier to fire a coach than it would be to trade Chad Johnson, Housh and others.

WILL GRANT: This team's woes may not be done with the coach. Two years ago, we talked about them as the team that you wanted your fantasy players from because they were just a point machine. Now, Cedric Benson is their leading rusher? Ouch. Unlike Jason, I see players leaving this team as well. I think a new coach brings a new face and a new attitude.

Expectations are always so high in Dallas. Will Philips get the axe if the Cowboys don't go far in the playoffs?

JEFF PASQUINO: Even if Wade Philips gets into the playoffs, I don't see Jerry Jones keeping him in place. They have a new stadium to sell out, and a new head coach could help. Wade is a much better defensive coordinator than a head coach.

JASON WOOD: Hard to imagine firing Wade Phillips but with Jason Garrett waiting in the wings and lots of other NFL jobs opening up, I could see Jerry Jones making the move if he feels Garrett is the long-term answer.

WILL GRANT: I would rank this one as a 'definite' happening if they miss the playoffs. This team could win 10 games and still miss the playoffs. Their talent level is better than it has been in a long time. Yet they still find a way to lose. Jason Garrett looked unbeatable at the start of the season... now you wonder where the offense has gone? I think Phillips needs to make the playoffs and win a game or two if he hopes to save his job.

Denver has all but collapsed over the last quarter of the season.

JASON WOOD: Shanahan will never be fired, but if he misses the playoffs or fails to win a playoff game, could he finally get the urge to go somewhere else? I could see him (or Mike Holmgren) landing in San Francisco

You'd think Rod Marinelli would get the axe in Detroit after going 0-16, perhaps soon-to-be 0-17, but William Clay Ford, Sr. says he may want to keep things in place.

JEFF PASQUINO: How bad are the Lions? Take this example. Six seconds into the second half against New Orleans (immediately after the kickoff return) they had to call a time-out because they weren't ready to go. Unfortunately the time-out was not awarded because they drew a flag for 12 men in the huddle. That's some solid coaching right there. Sorry Rod Marinelli - this isn't all your fault - but some of the blame has to go to you. You're better off for getting out of there while you can.

JASON WOOD: It would be absolutely inexcusable to keep Rod Marinelli in place after a 1-15 or 0-16 season, regardless of what the Fords may be saying publicly. He's being attacked by the media for nepotism, is about to be the first winless coach in league history, and has done nothing in any season to indicate he has a handle on things. Think of how bad the Lions might have been without Mike Martz' offense shenanigans in the last few seasons.

WILL GRANT: No way you become the first team in the league history to go 0-16 and stay employed. Lions will be cleaning house (again) in 2009 and a new head Coach will be about the only think that will bring the fans back. Cinci scored only 188 points so far this season and they have 3 wins and a tie. How can you not fire the coach after that?

What's the story in Jacksonville after the Jaguars' disappointing season?

WILL GRANT: Last Season Del Rio looked like he had the team to beat. This year, they can't seem to beat anyone. A smack down by Baltimore will have them losing 6 of their last 7. Not the best way to go into the offseason hoping to retain your job...

JASON WOOD: I agree that Del Rio has some explaining to do; however, I think he's safe as the team jettisoned their Player Personnel director James Harris.

In Kansas City, Herm Edwards is 6-25 over the past two years.

JASON WOOD: Herm is posturing that he won't resign, but that's really just about his wanting to be paid the remainder of his contract while someone else coaches the team in 2009. With a new GM coming aboard, you have to let the chef shop for the groceries, which means a new coach in 2009.

WILL GRANT: Another classic underperforming team in a weak division. San Diego showing signs of life, but everyone in this division has holes. Expect them to focus on QB and defense in their offseason. They definitely need a new change at the coaching helm.

Minnesota?

JASON WOOD: I have no idea what Ziggy Wulf thinks of the job Childress has done, but another late season swoon could invite an ouster.

WILL GRANT: If they miss the playoffs, I think Childress is gone. How good would this team have been if Favre was under center? How can a team consistently fall apart late in the season year after year?

The Jets?

JASON WOOD: New York papers are reporting that Mangini might be fired if he doesn't make the playoffs. We'll see.

WILL GRANT: Jets have another good season given their division, yet rumors still swirl around a HC change. I think Mangini and Favre stay for at least one more season.

Is there any telling what Al Davis will do in Oakland?

JEFF PASQUINO: Tom Cable, I wouldn't wish this on anyone. Every assistant seems to be abandoning ship, which is a strong indication of what you should do, too.

JASON WOOD: The Raiders aren't going to keep Tom Cable aboard.

WILL GRANT: This team has become a joke in the NFL. Is there any way to fire an owner? It wouldn't surprise me of John Madden was on the sidelines for 2009.

Philadelphia?

JEFF PASQUINO: Andy Reid may or may not go, this is a very interesting one. He clearly should not be calling plays on gameday and he is a much better non-gameday coach than on Sundays. His pass-happy playcalling has cost the Eagles a few games this year, along with bad clock management and challenges. He's not the only problem, but he's part of it.

JASON WOOD: A lot of Eagles fans hope Reid leaves, but let's be clear his job isn't in jeopardy. If he leaves it's because he wants to coach elsewhere, and I just don't see that happening.

WILL GRANT: Jason and Jeff are more the Eagle Authorities here but as Jason points out: Is Reid really the reason they might miss the playoffs this year? Their offense is one of the better ones in the league, and their defense is nothing to take lightly either. I think if Kevin Curtis is healthy to pair with Jackson next season, and this team becomes a legitimate threat to challenge the Giants for the Division. 2009 is going to be another brutal year for these teams.

The Rams will likely hire a new coach, with interim coach Jim Haslett on a nine-game losing streak.

JEFF PASQUINO: Jim Haslett wasn't the right guy even as an interim coach. The Rams need a strong personality to lead them. Rumor has it that Marshall Faulk may want a shot. If he does I'll root for him.

JASON WOOD: The Rams have already said they will hold an open interview process this offseason and allow Jim Haslett a chance to win the job against others. My view is if they had any faith in Haslett, they wouldn't have publicly announced the job to be open. Personally I fail to see why Haslett should get the job since the Rams defense has been abysmal under his stewardship.

WILL GRANT: Only Cinci has scored fewer points. How far has 'the greatest show on turf' really fallen. Their defense isn't stopping anyone either and yet they won more games than Detroit did. The key here for both St. Louis and Detroit is that it won't take 12 wins to make the playoffs - people are going to jump at the chance to get it done.

Will Mike Singletary get a real shot in San Francisco?

JEFF PASQUINO: I like Mike Singletary, but I can't exactly say why. I think he's a player's coach and has the personality that commands respect, which is half the battle. With him focused on defense and Mike Martz for offense, I think they can turn that ship around.

JASON WOOD: I'm sure the 49ers will give Singletary a chance at the job, but realistically is he the answer? I have my doubts.

WILL GRANT: I don't think that the coach is to blame for this team. Like Chicago, what did you expect with this offense? I think they've done a hell of a job given what they had to work with. I think Singletary lives for 2009 but is on a short leash.

Mike Holmgren has coached his last game in Seattle.

JEFF PASQUINO: Holmgren's out and we know that Jim Mora will be stepping in (insert "stepping in what" joke here).

Jim Zorn got off to a good start this year in Washington (after the first game), but has the public sentiment in the nation's capital turned on him?

JEFF PASQUINO: Jim Zorn was supposed to be the offensive coordinator when he was hired, not the head coach. He probably gets a second year but he doesn't seem like head coach material to me.

JASON WOOD: Jim Zorn has already been given the vote of confidence, and that's good because I don't think he deserves to worry about his job after a decent first year.

WILL GRANT: I agree with Jason here. Washington is a better team with Zorn and they just need a bit more time to put it together. The bigger question here is if Jason Campbell is the answer at QB?

Who are the prospects out there you'd be most excited about having your team hire if it were in the market for a new head coach?

JEFF PASQUINO: The two prospects I want to see get head coaching shots are Rex Ryan in Baltimore and Steve Spagnuolo from the Giants.

As with all head coaching decisions, you have to ask how much greener is the other side of the fence? Who will come in and do a better job than what you already have? The name everyone drops is Bill Cowher, and he could go to Cleveland if anywhere (he has ties to them as a former player), but that's one head coach. Who else is there? Eagles fans want change at head coach (and probably rightly so) but who are they going to get better than Reid at this point?

College Bowl Games

What college bowl games will you be watching (or DVRing) to help you prepare for next year's fantasy season? What players do you think have the best potential to make an immediate impact in the NFL, depending on where they end up?

We've got Sigmund Bloom in the house, so I'll let him run with this one.

SIGMUND BLOOM: I'll be watching all of the games. I could go on and on about players from each and every bowl game that interest me, but here's the top few players to watch for NEXT year:

Valero Alamo

Missouri vs. Northwestern San Antonio
Alamodome Dec. 29, 8 p.m. ESPN

• WR Jeremy Maclin, Missouri - (Underclass) lightning in a bottle, but he also has great size. Think Royal/Jackson's game in Reggie Wayne's body.
• TE Chase Coffman, Missouri - Tough, Big, just gets the job done in the middle of the field. Think Chris Cooley's game in Zach Miller's frame.

Roady's Humanitarian

Maryland vs. Nevada Boise, Idaho
Bronco Stadium Dec. 30, 4:30 p.m. ESPN

• WR Darrius Heyward-Bey, Maryland (Underclass) The next big WR the NFL will salivate over. It's unfair when a WR as big as DHB is that athletic.

Pacific Life Holiday

Oklahoma State vs. Oregon San Diego
Qualcomm Stadium Dec. 30, 8 p.m. ESPN

• TE Brandon Pettrigrew, Oklahoma State - An ideal physical prospect, will get more hype than Coffman and should light up the workouts.
• RB Jeremiah Johnson, Oregon - One of the best in a weak Senior RB class. Good initial burst, long speed, compact NFL RB frame.

Brut Sun

Oregon State vs. Pittsburgh El Paso, Texas
Sun Bowl Dec. 31, 2 p.m. CBS

• RB LeSean McCoy, Pittsburgh - (underclass) If he comes out, watch out, but he says he won't. Maybe the most instinctive RB in college football right now, and a true bell cow.
• WR Sammie Stroughter, Oregon State - Similar to Royal/Jackson, will return kicks, work the middle of the field, like them could overcome "slot WR" designation.

Outback

South Carolina vs. Iowa Tampa, Fla.
Raymond James Stadium Jan. 1, 2009, 11 a.m. ESPN

• RB Shonn Greene, Iowa - (underclass) - POWER. Will rank behind Wells/Moreno/McCoy, but has the best power game for the next level. A team that loves to run will love Greene.

Capital One

Georgia vs. Michigan State Orlando, Fla.
Florida Citrus Bowl Jan. 1, 2009, 1 p.m. ABC

• QB Matt Stafford, Georgia - (underclass) - maybe the most NFL ready QB, throws with great zip, battle tested, played in more pro style O.
• RB Knowshon Moreno, Georgia - (underclass) - Gritty, tremendous balance and drive, great hands and burst, a franchise back in the making.
• RB Javon Ringer, Michigan State - another standout in a weak senior class, but hard to excited about anything other than his production. Could make an impact in right situation.

Konica Minolta Gator

Clemson vs. Nebraska Jacksonville, Fla.
Jacksonville Municipal Stadium Jan. 1, 2009, 1 p.m. CBS

• RB CJ Spiller, Clemson (underclass) - Next in the Leon Washington/Felix Jones/Jerious Norwood line of dangerous change of pace backs.

AT&T Cotton

Ole Miss vs. Texas Tech Dallas
Cotton Bowl Jan. 2, 2009, 2 p.m. FOX

• WR Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech (underclass) - Not a physical prototype like Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald, but otherwise everything you'd want in a WR prospect. Should join the fantasy elite pretty quickly.

International

Buffalo vs. Connecticut Toronto
Rogers Centre Jan. 3, 2009, Noon ESPN2

• RB Donald Brown, UConn (underclass) - tremendous numbers, but won't test out as well as the big time underclass backs. Lunchpail type inside runner.

Tostitos Fiesta

Ohio State vs. Texas Glendale, Ariz.
University of Phoenix Stadium Jan. 5, 2009, 8 p.m. FOX

• RB Chris Wells, Ohio State - (underclass) Size/Speed combo is Turner-esque, back who can push the pile and run away from defenders (at least big 10 defenders), franchise back, but broke down before most important game this season.
• QB Colt McCoy, Texas - (underclass) Not as flashy as the other top underclass QBs, but might have best intangibles.

FedEx BCS National Championship Game

Oklahoma vs. Florida Miami
Dolphin Stadium Jan. 8, 2009, 8 p.m. FOX

• QB Sam Bradford, Oklahoma - (underclass) looks like a young Peyton to me. Could be the QB Detroit has been praying for.
• QB Tim Tebow, Florida - (underclass) Not an ideal prospect for NFL - big wind up release, hasn't run anything like a pro style offense, but will get a team hot and bothered like Vince Young did, and definitely has better mental toughness than VY.
• WR Percy Harvin, Florida - (underclass) - another "weapon" on O - you just want to get the ball in his hands 10-15 times a game. Great for the wildcat craze.

I know I left some players out, and not every underclassmen I listed here will go pro, but these are the most likely to make a splash in 2009.

JASON WOOD: Tough for me to add much beyond what Bloom has already talked about. I'm a college football bowl fan and try to watch as many as I have the time. Basically I start getting really hyped about the NFL Draft after bowl season, and let it come more organically during the games. I'm more interested in who jumps out at me as I'm watching, often times it will be guys that aren't the marquee names we hear about on SportsCenter all year.

Agreed. That's a terrific overview, Sigmund.

And with that, we're finished with this season's roundtable discussions. We'll be back in May to discuss some of the offseason player movement and draft selections. Until then, enjoy the rest of the season and the playoffs, and don't forget to drop into the Shark Pool forum from time to time over the next few months.